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The Everyday Trainer Podcast
The Everyday Trainer Podcast
Van Life Adventures: Balancing Dogs, Seasonal Shifts, and Sport Training
Welcome back ya'll. This week's episode explores the unique challenges of living in a van while managing the needs of multiple dogs during winter. We discuss the emotional toll of dog mom guilt, the importance of clear communication in training, and the balance between work and taking care of pets.
• Managing life updates and routines while living in a van
• Balancing dog care while grappling with dog mom guilt
• Adjusting to winter and understanding its impacts on lifestyle
• Navigating daily routines and training challenges in vans
• Communicating effectively with dogs through marker words
• Embracing the ebb and flow of seasonal changes in pets’ needs
• Finding harmony between work commitments and dog activities
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Hello, hello, welcome back to the Everyday Trainer podcast. My name is Meg and I am the dog trainer. Today's episode is pretty much a life update, so we're going to talk to you guys about what we're doing. We're still living out of the vans and uh in in relation to that dog mom guilt. I know so many of you feel that when you can't like entertain your dogs all day, so we're gonna touch on that. You know the drill grab yourself a tasty drink and meet us back here.
Speaker 2:Hey, toma, hello meet us back here. Hey, toma, hello, hello.
Speaker 1:Toma's really grumpy because it's 8.18 and it's past his bedtime.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've been going to bed pretty early. Following the sun, it gets dark at like 5.
Speaker 1:No, it gets dark at like 4.30.
Speaker 2:So there you go. It's past my bedtime. It's been dark for a couple hours.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we've been going to bed very early. The winter is kicking my ass. Coming from Florida to this Florida does not get this dark and cold.
Speaker 2:Winter Winter.
Speaker 1:Yeah, hey, it's cold, you're cold, it does get's cold.
Speaker 2:You're cold. It does get surprisingly cold. I think the clash is really how warm it is during the day and then how cool it is in the morning and at night.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But I don't know. I think van life would be the same up in Canada. It's just the fact that it gets dark so early. You kind of end up retreating to the vans and not doing much does it get dark earlier in canada? No, it's like the same, like around 4, 35 oh my gosh, this is kicking my butt it's like crazy that that doesn't happen in florida, like it doesn't get dark this early I know the days are more even because it's closer to the equator Subtropical.
Speaker 1:So we wanted to give you guys some life updates, because we haven't done a podcast like this in a while from the van. So we are currently parked in Encinitas in Toma's van. We just got our well, we just got my van cleaned out. So prior to today, river and Mink were in my van and we were basically like living in Toma's van and then mine was just like storage for my stuff plus River and Mink, and then all of our personal dogs are in Toma's van because River was sick with an upper respiratory infection when we got him. So I wanted to make sure that we didn't put any of our dogs at risk. And then, like I don't know how long has Mink been in my van with River.
Speaker 2:I feel like we've probably had River for like the past like 10 weeks now I want to say like two and a half months.
Speaker 1:Mink's been there for like two weeks yeah, something like that yeah.
Speaker 1:so mink has been in my van for like two weeks. So once we realized that like river was no longer contagious and he had been through so many antibiotics, we like really really went hard on like giving him antibiotics and constantly sanitizing ourselves and the van and all of that. So we got my van cleaned out yesterday and we've just kind of been hanging out in Encinitas because this has become like I've had lessons here. It's like home base, I guess as much as you could say.
Speaker 2:It's your favorite town. Toma does not like Encin.
Speaker 1:Guess as much as you could say it's your favorite favorite town toma does not like encinitas as much as I do I mean it's all right I like how walkable it is, like I like that we can get out of the van and just like walk the dogs and go get coffee it definitely has its perks and then you just like walk and you can like see the ocean, you know, and then like the co-working space like there's, like you know. And then like the co-working space Like there's like stuff you know.
Speaker 2:And then there's the train.
Speaker 1:The train, the dreaded train. When we first got here, there's like all of these signs in people's yards. They're like stop the train. You know like vote no on whatever, and I was like that's kind of ridiculous. And then you stay here for like a little bit and the train is constantly going.
Speaker 2:Like every time it like zooms through the town, like the conductor is like pulling the horn. I don't know if you guys can hear it now.
Speaker 1:I feel like they have to do that legally.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Like they have to like right.
Speaker 2:But what's funny? I don't know if you noticed the other highway exit of Encinitas, like the other, like hub hub, where the there's the camping area by the ocean yeah there's a sign there and it's a train cross crossing and it actually says like no horn, like will not honk, so it's like kind of like oh, maybe they voted no on the honking.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they got it yeah, but that's.
Speaker 2:That's the other side of town, we don't spend enough time over there yeah so we're in the the noisy, so we're in the noisy area.
Speaker 1:We're in the noisy area with the train, and sometimes we have to park right next to the train. I will say, though I really have not woken up from the train.
Speaker 2:Or the fireworks for the new year.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I guess we've been tired lately.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like van life exaggerates the whole daytime, nighttime, circadian rhythm, stuff, because it's not like this is the first time we've really had the big lights on in the van. For sure, when we go into the van it's like we just go to sleep.
Speaker 2:Yeah, pretty much.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Crawl into our giant human crate and call it a day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so we've been kind of boring with the dogs recently and I think part of that is because I'm trying to figure out the balance between work all the time and taking care of the dogs, you know.
Speaker 2:I think that's partially like why I don't like Encinitas. There's not enough like big open space Like just to let the dogs roam and stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:We have to retreat and go to the desert for a bit because of that.
Speaker 1:But that's kind of what we've been talking about is like we have to really decide if we want to commit to van life, because if we do commit to van life, then we have to travel, like we have to leave, and part of the reason that we've been hanging around like where we've been is because of the people that we train with. You know, the people that I work with, you know like clients or other dog trainers, and also like let's be real the internet and we don't have, like we haven't gotten like systems in place for like the van life right, like we're very we're living very like minimalist as far as like van life goes, like it's not luxurious, it's not like we're living very like minimalist as far as like van life goes, like it's not luxurious. It's not like we're like we have to do dishes, we have no water in the tank.
Speaker 2:you know, I mean we got, you know, very nice Sprinter vans Like we can't complain, right, but the fact of the matter is they're both not finished so we don't have any storage set up, like for our clothes and everything. We're just like still basically living out of duffel bags. And then, yeah, recently I've built in a kitchen, but it's also like not fully functional, like I feel like the kitchen we've only had pretty much for like two months or three months maybe. So in theory we have running water, but we also haven't figured out, like where to fill up the water tanks. I feel like this is an issue that I'd never really had like that much in the past, but I think in california it's pretty hard to find like fill up stations. So if you know anyone has any advice where have we been looking?
Speaker 1:though we haven't looked that hard we haven't, but it's not worth it to me.
Speaker 1:I don't like cooking no, but I think like we just need water, like water is like essential yeah, so right now we're just buying jugs of water and we go through so many because we have so many dogs like think about how much water you drink as a person, plus like all of your dogs, like it's quite a bit, so we've been doing that, basically living in toma's van.
Speaker 1:It is nice, though, because we have batteries, so we have a fridge and a freezer which is game changer, I would say but I don't really like to store things that we have to cook, because I feel like, right now, how our lives are set up, it's like we haven't figured out the systems that we need to be able to, like one run my business, you know, so that was like a whole other thing is I do a lot of stuff online, like not just in my own business, but in other dog trainers' businesses, and like we recorded Oscar's workshop, and I'm building websites and I have to have internet, like High-speed internet I have to have high-speed internet, because essentially my issue has been I cannot upload videos.
Speaker 1:And I talked to a whole bunch of video people and they're like, yeah, you basically have to get like fiber and it still takes forever. So when you live in a house, it's not a big deal because you can just like download stuff like overnight. You know like you can just have downloads like running in the background. But for me it's like when we put up the starlink, that's when we have internet, you know like we don't have starlink plugged in. I'm like, wait, no, don't plug it in yet. Like wait until after we record the podcast. And then you plug it in because you don't want to like waste battery space and like electricity and you know, but even with starlink, like when starlink is running, I cannot download files these side, like this size.
Speaker 1:And also another thing too is like think about you know us just driving from la to encinitas, which is an hour and 20 minute drive with no traffic like I had to pull over.
Speaker 1:Remember, because, like shane's website published and we had had to pull over. Remember because, like Shane's website published and we had to like pull over and I had to like, like Shane's website finally got published. We built it out and I wanted to make sure that, like everything was good and there were some things that we needed to fix, like because it just went live like we transferred the domain over, so we had to like pull over, and it's like we couldn't do that if we were in the middle of nowhere, you know. So, like there are some aspects to like if we do commit to do van life, like I have to figure out what that looks like like. I would have to figure out how to upload videos on my community. I would have to figure out how to, you know, outsource some of the other like website building and community building aspects of my business, because we can't do it from the middle of nowhere right now.
Speaker 1:It's a huge challenge yeah, so I feel like that's kind of the main reason why I like encinitas is because it has all the things that, like I need to function at the current state, you know for sure but with that, I feel like, because we have to stay in a city, we're not able to do as much with the dogs, you know yeah, like the idea of van life is that you can go be out in the middle of nowhere, and when we are out in the middle of nowhere and when we are out in the middle of nowhere and we get to like go hike with our dogs, like it's literally the best thing ever, right, because we can just have them out, we don't have to worry about people walking up to us, like it's not a big deal.
Speaker 1:But the reality of that is like we don't have battery and we don't have water, like we can't stay out in the middle of nowhere for too long before I have to like jump back on wi-fi and like do some stuff online and even like posting. You know, just the online component of our lives.
Speaker 2:I feel like yeah, it's definitely a challenge. And then I mean I don't want to say like we're not doing anything with our dogs, like when we're going up to LA, like we're spending a lot of time with like Shane and Oscar and we're like training our Malinois, but then it's the remaining dogs that kind of get the short end of the stick.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like when we are training dogs with the sporty people and doing the sporty things, our Malinois sporty dogs are fulfilled and it's like okay, but what about like the Goldens, you know, and like River? I have been training River around all the other dogs though, so I feel like he's been pretty fulfilled. But just kind of like managing the day-to-day with dogs that you know, the dog mom guilt that everybody feels when they don't do enough with their dog, like I definitely feel that. But I do think it's important to understand that life comes in waves, right like there are periods where, like the dogs are truly living their best life, like they've traveled across the country they've literally ran all across the country, you know like we've been in some of the coolest places with them. But then, on the flip side of that, because we have this life with them, like there are slow days, like today.
Speaker 2:And I mean I think that's totally fine. Like for New Year's, we were in the desert, in like was it yucca valley, and they're all roaming and, you know, living their best life, and this past week we haven't done that much with them, you know. Yeah, they still get, like, you know, walked around town, whatever, but it's it's a lot less um active yeah but you know they can all have down time in the crates and you know Walter's like sleeping on the floor and we literally didn't do much with them today, you know so.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the dogs are able to do both.
Speaker 1:I think too it's important to kind of like slow down in winter, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the new year.
Speaker 1:The new year.
Speaker 2:That doesn't actually like technically. Really start now.
Speaker 1:In my mind. I am very much a believer that winter is a time to kind of like hibernate, right, and spring should be the new year. That's my hot take. So when everybody's, like you know, hustling and doing all of these New Year's plans, I think maybe it's a time instead for like introspection, you know, so that you're planting the seeds for when spring comes around.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So time to slow down and maybe look at our schedules, look at our day today, and you know, also understand that things are going to fluctuate with seasons, so like right now. One thing that I've been talking to toma all the time about is I'm like I feel like I'm so tired, like I I think I kind of missed that a little bit in florida is like the days are so even so you never really like feel the seasons, but there's something about that. You know, like I am not a tired person, I am not like a sleepy person, but for us to be going to bed at literally like 8 30 and we wake up at like I don't know seven, like we're sleeping for so long, you know that's like unheard of for me I think it's good maybe you know you do need the rest but also like um people talk about like seasonal depression or like there's also like um, like temperature change but like pressure change, like I think there's like a lot of components to it.
Speaker 2:But yeah, we're definitely like more yeah, that's what van life does is really like exaggerate all of that yeah, yeah, it's definitely like a lot more exaggerated than if, like, we were in a house and you know, maybe you'd have the lights on, you're'd be watching TV or whatever. Like it just changes the routine. Not that we like watch TV or anything, but I think it makes a difference, like being in a van for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so our current day-to-day right now, during this kind of slow season for us and the dogs, while we're kind of figuring out, I don't know, our lives.
Speaker 2:The next steps.
Speaker 1:Like what we're going to do while we're figuring out the next steps is you know, we're really going with the schedule of the day, so we wake up at I wake up at five.
Speaker 2:I wait two hours until you wake up.
Speaker 1:Wake up at sunrise and then we take all the dogs out to go get coffee. We'll do groups or individuals. Zoe usually goes first because she's the old lady. She's got to get her morning poop out immediately.
Speaker 2:Yeah, then we'll go Millie Minkainka goose with zoe, occasionally then walter and hawk separately.
Speaker 1:Same for mink and river rotate everybody and then everybody goes back into the crates. They'll get water, sometimes breakfast. We don't always feed our dogs the same time every day. We feed them once a day. It'll either be in the morning or in the evening. I have to say I think I like the evening better.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'd say we're a lot more consistent. Well, we mainly feed in the evening. If they get fed in the morning, it's for whatever reason we had a busy day, ran out of dog food, and then it's the next morning they get fed. In the morning it's like, for whatever reason, like we, you know, had a busy day, ran out of dog food, and then it's like the next morning they get fed, but normally, like it's always in the evening that they get fed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like that better because I feel like I don't like the dogs to be super active after we feed them, so I want them to just chill in the crates for a couple hours after we feed them, because I'm terrified of bloat. And the reason why we feed them once a day is because it's actually better for like recovery, so when our bodies are constantly like consuming food, they don't ever go into that like repair and recover state, and so I'm a firm believer that less is more as far as meals go with our dogs, and not only is it beneficial for their health, but it just kind of makes your life a little bit easier only feeding once a day for sure you know, especially for us yep, the malinois are in raw, everyone else on kibble.
Speaker 2:The other funny thing is it's very apparent like the dogs that eat raw need less water oh yeah, the malinois drink literally don't drink water yeah, like I, I don't drink water. Yeah, like I give like a like a pail of water and all the other dogs are like downing it, like they're thirsty and you could literally give the same bowl to the dog. They're like looking at you like meh, like I don't need the water now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I tried to give Minka water before this and she was like no, thank you.
Speaker 2:I can guarantee you hawks pails full and like walters is like empty, guaranteed yeah, it kibble, dries them out so much yeah but I mean it makes sense.
Speaker 1:You know we've completely taken the moisture out and we just feed all of the other dogs kibble, for like we just don't have the storage, I can't even imagine no, like logistically in the vans it's quite challenging to feed dogs raw like.
Speaker 2:We got a limited amount of like plug-in, like electrical freezer space and then we actually had to go buy a yeti cooler and that's a whole other deal as well. Like you need to like be constantly buying ice and you know we're buying like a good amount of raw like we wouldn't like physically have this place to have enough like freezer space for like eight dogs yeah, we would need like a deep freeze cold chest freezer in the van like there's no way no, it's impossible yeah, but we do get them raw bones.
Speaker 1:Everybody gets raw bones yep we'll do like the marrow bone. Sometimes we did necks, turkey necks yeah, they love it they love those and it's good to clean their teeth, so that's kind of like their maintenance stuff. But in the mornings we take everybody for a nice walk. We'll go check out the ocean when we're by the beach, come back into the vans, load everybody back up, and that's when we've been having to work yeah, head to a coffee shop it's been boring, boring lives, yeah.
Speaker 1:So either we'll go to a coffee shop and work, or today I found a workspace so that I could download things, which I got two whole videos downloaded in like six hours, so from like what? 10 until I left at like 2. I couldn't do it anymore. I was like I cannot From 10 to 2.30,. I was in the co-working space. My dogs were in the van in my van and then you were going to do laundry. It was just one of those like boring weekends and then yesterday yesterday was also boring.
Speaker 2:We weren't able to do a whole lot with the dogs because I had to clean my van out, you know yeah, I mean, that was just like transferring things over from my van back in the years and then yeah, today, just lots of like housekeeping stuff.
Speaker 1:But on those days when we do a lot of housekeeping stuff like we're really not able to do that much with the dogs.
Speaker 2:But I don't necessarily think that it would be any different if we had regular people lives no, no, it'd be absolutely the same you know, like on days where we have to like do something for like six hours if anything, I would say like van life's actually it almost helps the dogs, like it's we.
Speaker 2:We haven't had river for long, right, and like transferring the, the, the belongings, between the two vans, like we had, like you know, river in the crate next literally in the parking lot and there were like people walking by with their dogs and stuff and he like wasn't reactive or anything like you, just I feel like the dogs would get very um used to our routine like very quickly. So I think it's like beneficial for they're used to like the constant change yeah, constant change, constant change of environments like we had.
Speaker 2:We had lucy out, uh, and we're just loading a bunch of shit in my van and she's just like so unfazed. Yeah, the chaos, okay, this is what we're doing now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I go in here. Okay, that's fine. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's great socialization for the dogs, or like even today, when we were just like standing outside of my van and like the van door is open and all the dogs are just like sitting there, just like watching you know, in random parking lots or in random streets. Yeah, like we can open the van anywhere and they're just like, like completely unfazed because just become like a part of their life a totally new environment like every day.
Speaker 2:Like I feel like that's a huge perk actually to have like van life dogs yeah, and the cool thing is too.
Speaker 1:It's like you never have to be like, oh, we have to go back home to let the dogs out.
Speaker 2:It's like we just walk to the van we got everything we need with us all the time yeah, we can just like walk to the van and just like let them out yeah, no it's, it's nice. There's definitely perks to it. We're just like little snails of our we got what is it? Slow, slow cars, but fast houses oh my gosh some van life quotes right here never heard of that before in my life.
Speaker 1:That's so funny. So yeah, we're still trying to figure out what we're going to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, we've got two options Either we buy some property in the middle of the woods and become more secluded, or we go warehouse style downtown, or van life. Yeah, but basically to do the van life sustainably, we would need to get you a full build and finish my build yeah.
Speaker 1:And that's the whole other thing that we've been trying to figure out is I got on a call with a van builder last week just to kind of talk to him about what that would look like Getting my van built out, because something about my van is it's a passenger van, so all of the walls are windows and I have an ac unit in the roof, which has been very, very nice yeah, so it's a factory like mercedes factory ac, so it works while the vehicle is running.
Speaker 2:But for like a van build it's not like a 12 volt ac, so like whatever for the van builder it's not ideal for a van builder.
Speaker 1:So I talked to this guy last week and he was basically like I would not recommend your van. I think you should get a new one. I think you should get a 170. I have a 144, so it'd be the longer version which is your van. I do not like driving your van yeah my van. I did we ever talk about me driving your van? Getting it stuck I got it stuck at the bottom of mike's driveway my van's also like a older model, so you can get a 170.
Speaker 2:But like a newer model it'll drive like yours his is literally like driving a school bus yeah, I got very big wheels and tires on there. You hit the brakes. They're a little spongy.
Speaker 1:You're still going forward yeah, and mine drives like a little sedan yeah a little whip around car, yeah it drives like a little car, so going from his and I was like, oh my gosh, I do not want a long van so anyways, I was talking to this van build guy last week and he was like, yeah, I mean, if you're gonna live out of your vans full time, like I think you need the longer one because of how many dogs you have, and ideally you get a cargo that doesn't have any windows. And I was like, ah, I figured that you would say that. So then I went through all the steps of like what it would look like for me to get another van and then I was like, actually I don't think I want a long van, I would rather have a short van, because we take our vans off-roading a lot, like we're on a lot of just I don't know forest logging, yeah, just forest roads and I feel like my van like whips on those roads.
Speaker 1:I'm not, I'm not, I'm not willing to sacrifice, like I don't want that you know. So I was like you know what. I think I'm just gonna keep my van and also it cost me a bunch of money to get a new van yeah, we kind of figured out how we can do it with your current van, make it work.
Speaker 1:So it's just if we can find somebody to do it you know, because nobody wants to build the van with the ac unit in the roof and the windows because it's kind of a pain in the ass. So if they could build out a passenger van, it's more of like a clean slate. And basically we've talked to a few van build people and I feel like no one really wants. No one wants to take me on no, I wouldn't take you on either.
Speaker 1:Yeah like no one. I'm like well, we have to fit four dog crates and and people are like.
Speaker 1:They either like price me super, super, crazy expensive, or they're like no, I think you should get a different van yeah yeah, so with the last van builder guy, if I got my van built out with them it would be around 45 000 which is honestly not that bad, which is not that bad as far as a full van build go, but the the reason why I say that is because I remember like years ago when I was looking into getting my van built or like be living full-time out of a van, I feel like people were very people didn't want to talk about how much it costs to like build a van and obviously if we did it ourselves it would be much cheaper.
Speaker 2:But I don't want to do that yeah, just the convenience of time like that it actually takes to do.
Speaker 1:Like you know, I've been working on my van on and off for like over two years I'm not gonna do that, like I need to send it to somebody to have it done in like weeks timely manner yeah like I can't. I can't do that, it would just be nearly impossible.
Speaker 2:And it's also the whole question of where do you live in the meantime that you don't have the van stuff yeah and also even before that. We've got to decide if that's what we want to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's the other thing too. Is it's like all right, well, $45,000 is a decent chunk of change? Is that where we want to put that? You know, like Decisions, decisions. Very real conversations.
Speaker 2:So yeah, that's kind kind of that's a down payment on the house right there yeah, literally.
Speaker 1:But I don't know. I don't really like see myself living in a traditional house. Like I was thinking about it because katie sent me a video of gretchen. So gretchen is back in florida with one of my previous trainers trainers Katie. She's living out of the house and I was like, oh, I miss the yard because, like all the dogs are like playing in the yard and I'm like, oh, my gosh, I feel like my whole life is just like maintaining a house.
Speaker 1:Like there's so much stuff in that house, like so I think I'm just like overstimulated from like stuff because, like even now we only have I mean, we do have stuff at Mike's, but like we don't have that much stuff in the grand scheme of things, like compared to like most people, I would say like the average person we do not have that much stuff, but it's still overwhelming to me. Like I want to have like three items, I want to have like three pairs of pants and three shirts, and like a mug and like that's it. And it's like if that mug breaks, then I go and get another mug and like that's it.
Speaker 1:That's all I have I sit in body minimalism maybe I'm just like overstimulated and overwhelmed, for in the past couple years, you know so, I'm like swinging super far in the other direction. But that's where I'm just like overstimulated and overwhelmed, for in the past couple years, you know so, I'm like swinging super far in the other direction, but that's where I'm at currently. I can't, I can't picture myself like in a house. Like I can't, I don't want to furnish a house.
Speaker 1:Like I don't want to go and buy a bunch of stuff yeah, no, I just like I cannot picture that, but I can I can more so picture a like facility, space, like I think that would be cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, something like roll the vans in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because I feel like everything that you would like have in there is kind of like a necessity, you know. Yeah, like it'd be cool to have you know, just like collecting random personal items that are just kind of like all over the house.
Speaker 2:That are just kind of like all over the house Like ideal workshop space, whatever would have like a bathroom, shower, washer, dryer, and then, like you know, a loft above With like a place to hang out and like actually work.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that literally would solve all our problems.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:High speed internet.
Speaker 1:High speed internet.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:Crazy and then like a training space, yeah, but then we're also kind of like giving up the van life because you know we'd be there every day yeah, but then it's no different than like us being like parked up in a city because we need wi-fi, right?
Speaker 2:so I know, that's what I'm saying is like you could have your space and then we still have like a van to like drive off and go to the desert or the mountains or whatever if we do commit to the van life.
Speaker 1:I have to find systems in my business that run without me having to pop on internet every morning and afternoon for sure you know, or you know, elon just got to make a better starlink yeah, I don't know what's up with that.
Speaker 2:I don't I think it's functional, for I'm like tech savvy enough. You know what I'm saying, but like I don't, I'm not that deep into it yeah, I don't know if there's any other companies that have any like other options that are like better no, I don't think so like I know there's like the, we boost like we're talking shit about starlink, but it's still pretty amazing uh yeah, I have people message me all the time.
Speaker 1:They're like how do you have service literally in all of these crazy places and it's starlink yeah, we're like in the middle of the woods.
Speaker 2:There's like sequoias everywhere, yeah, and you can just like pop up the wifi to be fair. It's very good, I think it's just not good enough for like what you need because you're like uploading videos like big videos yeah so I don't know. Hopefully technology just improves in the next year.
Speaker 1:We'll see we'll see what happens, I don't know. Hopefully technology just improves in the next year, we'll see. We'll see what happens, I don't know. But yeah, that's kind of where we're at. So in the meantime I feel like our lives have been kind of boring for the dogs.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but you know it goes in waves.
Speaker 1:It's boring for us too.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:A little pent up, tomo's very pent up. He hasn't gotten to like run around or like play at the park at all I need to do something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, play at the park. Maybe you sound like a toddler we've been taking tomo to the bicycle track.
Speaker 1:so now he's all pent up. It's true, though You're just like a dog.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I need to fucking exercise.
Speaker 1:Is that too much to ask? We gotta have some boring days, though, because I gotta get some work done sometimes.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:But I think the importance is the balance. You know, tori's been on vacation for a week and a half and when she gets back I'm going to be like all right, tag, putting you to work. Tag, you're in, you're in, I need to take off Now. I'm just playing.
Speaker 2:Where are we going? I don't know.
Speaker 1:I don't know. So we're obviously in ensign. He has said that about a million times, but we're gonna be heading back up to la over the next couple weeks. We're probably gonna hang out there. So we've been and I feel like we've. We've learned a lot we've learned a lot about sporty stuff for sure, I am a professional. I'm a professional sporty girl not me but I know the things she thinks she knows the things. I do. I've been watching.
Speaker 2:For sure. I mean, I just feel like I feel like I've known the things you know, and then it's like, okay, you're actually handling. And then you're watching like the professionals do it and it's like, oh, you really know nothing, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's all Shane does is train his dogs. That's all Shane does. That's all Chris does.
Speaker 2:I feel like we don't speak about Chris enough. Chris Sykes is amazing. Chris Sykes is a really good dog trainer. Yeah, no, it's really neat to watch them all train and see their little quirks that are kind of similar. They clearly all train together a lot and, um, yeah, I don't know, I feel like we're like learning a thing or two, you know. So our handling's improving in the sport world oh yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1:No, learning all the things, what would you say is like the most, like, oh my gosh. Yes, that's so great thing that you've learned so far.
Speaker 2:I mean, they're just holding me accountable to like slowing down and it like sounds so obvious, but I'm actually starting to do it. You know, I don't know. The double marker, the double marker, yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, so listen to this. So marker words in dog training it's like, for example, yes, yes For me equals. That was perfect. You're done with whatever I asked. Come get your reward. Mushy people say yes and move at the same time, right, and so that, like it just is messy. The whole point of a marker word is that word creates anticipation that a reward is coming. But if you're reaching for your reward or you're moving your tug, as soon as you say yes, I in my mind, you might as well not even say yes, right, because like you're doing it at the same time as like the movement, and so your marker then is the movement. It's not the word. But let's say we're doing heel with a dog, we call them into heel, they come into heel, and we mark that with a yes. I don't know where I was going with this so I'd go further than that.
Speaker 2:Not only, like you know, you, whatever you mark and you like move fast. I feel like it's accentuated with the sporty dogs, like they're fast dogs, so like as a handler, like you want to do everything fast because, like you know, the dogs like super fast, but basically, no, but pet people do this too for sure, for sure, but it's like almost more valuable to slow things down with a dog.
Speaker 2:That's fast which is funny because if your communication isn't clear when you mark the dog's, like right away, like nipping for the ball right, but then like the whole value of the double marker, is you really really slow everything down. Really take your time so it's like your dog's in this focus heel, he's got the amazing prance right. You mark like let's say yes, the dog can now exit. The behavior of, like the focus heel spins around you, looks at you for the reward and like I, for instance, previously, would only mark one.
Speaker 1:So the dog is like already expecting, like to get paid and then you're like racing to grab the tug, or like racing to grab the food and then the dog, like naturally because like that's been the the picture right away goes and nukes your hand for the tug right.
Speaker 2:So you mark once the dog exits the behavior and then you very slowly like would grow, grab your ball, present the ball in front of the dog. The dog's like slow yeah and then you mark again yes, and then the dog could bite it, oscar said the double marker.
Speaker 1:The first marker marks the end of the behavior and the second marker marks you can get the ball or tug. And if the tug is out, and I mark, you can get the tug right. Yeah, correct so like they're not always using a double marker. But the reason why I like the double marker so much is because it makes you slow down yeah, you use the double marker when the reward is hidden. Yes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, game changer.
Speaker 1:But let's talk about marker words, because this is the bane of my existence. Yes, work, yes, work is the bane of my existence. I don't even know what, yes, work is, but that's what everybody tells me that they're doing is, and I do not like it, I think. I mean, I don't know, I don't know. I'm not trying to, like, pick a fight well, I think, what's really what I?
Speaker 1:all I know is yes, is a marker word right? And the whole point of having marker words is that it creates anticipation of something coming right. So yes, is a reward is coming that could be food, a tug, a ball no, is what's coming. A punishment is coming, a leash pop, even spatial pressure. You know, like no, is the marker that like a punisher is coming. Yes, is the marker that a reward is coming.
Speaker 1:But we've gotten sloppy with our markers and I'm blaming the quote yes work, because that's what I'm getting from people. So when I'm doing like the virtual shadow program and we're yesing everything and we're moving at the same time that we're using yes and we're marking yes for like all different types of things, I feel like it really loses that. It loses the whole point of marker training, which is to create anticipation of a reward coming coming. So I really like the double marker because it forces you to slow down and not rush in getting that reward to your dog. You can genuinely take your time.
Speaker 1:I was talking to Justin, one of my previous virtual shadow program students, about this, because he has a sporty dog and he's always posting videos of him training his Doberman. So I like, oh my gosh, I have all of these things now and I was watching his videos and like I had had this discussion with him with his markers, because he was saying yes with everything. Sometimes he was rewarding in position, sometimes he was rewarding out of position. But like yes never meant like the same thing. You know there's no like consistency in like the expectations for the dog right. So like with the double marker that we're talking about, yes if the ball is away means that the reward is coming, I'm getting it for you. If the ball is out, yes means you can get it. But I feel like it gets a little bit messy when we're just kind of yesing everything and we're also yesing and moving at the same time, because there's no anticipation for a reward coming. The marker of the reward coming is your movement, not the word yeah I feel like spiel I don't know.
Speaker 2:I feel like people that like talk about, yes, work, it's like they just scratched like the surface. Like you know you're so close, the tip of the iceberg. They think you're so close and I guess they feel like you know it's revolutionary, but it's kind of like not really used properly. Like the beauty of marker words like truly is, like you can have so many markers and the more like that you have and the more consistent and clear you are with like how you use them. Like you can truly have like an amazing communication with your dog. Like you know, yes, reward on you.
Speaker 2:I mean, I I don't want to, like you know, say too much, but I have a different marker for like a ball or a tug than I do for food. Um, just for clarity, like my dog, my dog, knows like the expectation of like the reward he's going to receive. Um, so like for me it's like chip for a ball or a tug and then, yes, for food, get it is you're getting the ball that's already on the ground. And then like something that's new for me that I'm trying to implement is something that Shane uses a lot. So he does get it for the ball that's already on the ground. But if he's throwing it, he says go, and so he says go and his dog's actually already sprinting downfield and then he throws the ball. That's just like another.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can have so many markers, yeah but I think, like getting clear on that, like that's, that's such a good point, right, because when people are saying, yes, what are you telling the dog to do? Yeah, people cannot answer that question the dog doesn't know.
Speaker 2:And the reason the dog doesn't know is because the handler actually doesn't know, you don't know. Like people are paying yes terminally in position like yes and keeping the dog in a down on on a place and then they also don't like, sometimes they don't want the dog to break, and then sometimes they say yes, and it is a break.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just confusing I think what I see, the yes stuff, yes work, I'm gonna air quotes yeah, I don't like, I don't really know the difference in the semantics of like, the difference between that and like marker word training.
Speaker 2:I've always just I just always thought it was like using markers right um damn.
Speaker 1:I lost my train of thought. Where was?
Speaker 2:I going with this oh.
Speaker 1:Where I mostly see it being used is with um, counter conditioning, right? People think that if, let's say, we have a reactive dog and you're standing with your, your reactive dog, your reactive dog is looking at another dog, isn't reacting, just looking, and they want to mark that with a yes and then pay the dog. I don't like this one because people are not communicating to the dog what is expected after, what you need to do. When you hear that yes. I think it's different when we can use it as a positive, like disruptor, right. So if you've taught the dog, yes means bust your happy butt back over to me to come and get the reward, because a reward is coming for you, right. So break your command, come back to me, get the thing Right.
Speaker 1:So, like in that situation, we have our reactive dog staring at a dog, we say, yes, it disrupts it, just the same as like an e-caller would, right it, just the same as like an e-collar would right. But that only works when you've built up a clear meaning of what that marker word means and what the dog needs to do when they hear that marker word. If you are just standing with your dog staring at the trigger, marking yes, and paying I don't. I don't think that that is helpful, I don't think that that is like proper marker training. And I could very well be wrong, but do you kind of see what I'm trying to say?
Speaker 2:oh, 100, like when you I get what we're trying to do.
Speaker 1:I like, oh, my dog is staring another dog, so I'm going to make that rewarding, right? So I'm going to say yes and then pay. But like, don't even say yes, right. Like, if you don't want the dog to leave or do anything, why are you marking? I guess is what I'm saying, like, if we're saying yes and delivering food in position at the same time, like, why not just like, pay the dog in that position?
Speaker 2:And yeah, in my thinking that'd be a continuation marker.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's like good, but then in my mind you're just standing there teaching the dog to like fixate, fixate and stare at the trigger and that's like a whole other thing is like we won't, because, like, what are we rewarding?
Speaker 2:that's what I was thinking like right, like in my mind.
Speaker 1:I personally that is not how I work through reactivity and I posted about this and I got a bunch of dog trainers that were like I, I disagree, which is totally fine, but in my mind, like I really like to look at dog social behavior and I'm sorry, but like standing and staring and like glaring at a dog is not proper social behavior. So why are we standing next to our dogs and practicing that behavior that is not like socially acceptable amongst dogs, like even amongst people? If we were standing, like if you were standing there just like staring at me, like not breaking eye contact with me, like it's, it's weird.
Speaker 1:Like it's a it's a, it's a form of pressure and it's the same thing for dogs. Like it's a, it's a, it's a form of pressure and it's the same thing for dogs. So I hate, I hate the like standing and staring and like rewarding in place using yes, and sometimes we reward in place and sometimes we'll move the dog and like it's just, it's so, so, unclear to the dog in my eyes, whereas if we really condition our yes marker word to mean come back to me, get your reward, like be excited about it, we can pull that dog out of that fixation, which I don't think that they should be doing regardless, because it's a weird social thing that, like properly socialized dogs are not doing like fixating on each other, and we get some motivation to come to us yeah, now first and foremost, like the marker should be charged the marker has to mean something yes.
Speaker 1:Yes, and our dogs are so, so smart. I cannot keep up with the markers. It's me. You know what I'm saying. Yeah 100%.
Speaker 2:When you have a lot of markers, the reason why people struggle is because they're not consistent.
Speaker 1:The dog is smart.
Speaker 2:The dog knows.
Speaker 1:So I use yes is a release from a command Come back to me, get your reward. Good is stay there, keep doing that. I'm going to come to you and I'm going to reward you in position. But whenever we're using these marker words like we have to be so consistent and so clear.
Speaker 2:Or else it is kind of useless. Yeah, then it's just like random words here. Yeah, it doesn't mean anything but, it has to be so consistent and literally the same picture every single time every single time when shane says go, it means that slim is already sprinting the reward is gonna be down there, go get it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know and that's very different than get it, because when he says get it, the dog's like turning right and like going for the ball, but he's actually already looking for the ball. That's already on the ground, you know. Yeah, that's a nuance on its own yeah, I don't know how.
Speaker 1:How do you think you could do like a double marker in pet stuff?
Speaker 2:is it applicable? I don't know I mean, it's really the same. Concepts like, let's say, I don't know like you're anything like, say, your dog's in a down, you say, yes, the dog pops from the down, but the thing is, pet dogs are not that motivated.
Speaker 1:They're not that driven.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, I give Hawk a double marker and he's literally spinning around me like just land shark ready for that second.
Speaker 1:But I do think that they could be built up to that, because if I said yes to my dogs, like, I think I could do that with like throwing a ball. Yeah I mean you know like heel, heel, heel. Yes, take my time, grab the ball, they're waiting, waiting, waiting. I could toss it and be like go, you know. Yeah, but like same sort of thing even like food.
Speaker 2:Like, say, you're walking down the street, your dog is in a heel, you mark, yes, the dog breaks the heel. He looks at you, he's just like in front of you, like little jumping prance, a little happy, a little excited, and then, yes, again pay like you know it?
Speaker 1:just it creates way more clarity that way yeah, it's honestly with pet dogs like it's.
Speaker 2:Like the double marker is essentially a way for the handler to remember to count to five before putting their hand in their pocket and giving the kibble and it sounds so obvious. But then, like I'm training with other trainers and I'm getting called out all the time they're like wow toma reaching in at the same time and it's like, oh yeah, I know this, but then doing it is two different things yeah so I think the double marker really is just that.
Speaker 2:It's like a foolproof method to actually breaking down. You mark, you pause, then your hand reaches in the pocket and grabs the kibble. Five seconds later you know you pay the dog.
Speaker 1:That's like pretty much all the double marker really is yeah, more or less like um, somebody sent me a video from justin rigney, uh, talking about this, about with dolphins how they have like a whistle to mark like you did the thing come get your reward.
Speaker 1:You know, yeah, he's like they're not just like chucking fish at the dolphins, like they mark with their whistle on the third, you know, jump that the dolphin does. The dolphin hears the reward whistle. They come back get their reward. Right, but like it's not happening like at the same time as the whistle, it doesn't have to happen at the same time as the whistle. That's the whole point of the whistle is to mark the behavior and to mark the anticipation of the reward coming.
Speaker 2:It's a snapshot in time of the moment that I liked, and the reward comes after.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we went down the marker word rabbit hole.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 1:No, but this has been a thing that, like Recently, a marker word rabbit hole no, but this has been a thing that, like recently, I'm arguing with people all the time over this because I feel like I get lumped into the yes work um trainers who are like it doesn't matter if you're saying the yes and rewarding at the same time, like it just it's not that important and it's like that's literally the whole point yeah, it's very interesting, that's literally the whole point of markers in in like for whatever reason, pet training.
Speaker 2:There's more of a divide of opinion on like what markers are, whatever. And then literally every sport club, different sports across the world, like you know french ring, igp, like from germany, like psa, american like it doesn't matter. You know, like sports from across the world are very clear about like how markers work and like what they are.
Speaker 1:You know so it's very interesting. It is very interesting because we've learned a lot.
Speaker 2:Honestly Like literally trainers in Canada and US and whatever. Like you get to any club and markers are so clear. Yeah, Like it's not a really, it's not an argument.
Speaker 1:I really wish that I could be a dog. Sporty girl, I mean, I don't, but I like the idea of it yeah I don't know, we'll see. I like training with everybody, but I'm definitely like the worst sporty person you know yeah, but I think there's a couple like reasons why you know yeah, for sure like but I do think it makes you a better pet trainer yeah, as well, for sure you know, well, yeah, these dogs are just so fast like you have to be clear in your communication, you know yeah, it's very interesting, like hanging out with shane and oscar and like seeing how they train.
Speaker 1:They're very heavy obedience, right, because like that's all they do, like that's literally all they do. And I have been quoted on this podcast as I am an obedience hater, you know, and that's just my personal thing. Like I will go out and I'll like train with you guys and I'll like have fun, but I'm not like super serious, like everybody is very competitive, you know, and I'm just like not that competitive, like it's just not that serious. You know, I'm saying so. I feel like that's kind of why I'm like I don't like obedience, because it just kind of gets like very repetitive and I'm like, oh my gosh, like I'm literally like minka with like doing sports. You know like minka will do it, but she's like, yeah, whatever, and it's like minka is a thousand percent like that. Because I'm like that. You know, like if I was super into sports she would be like, yeah, like a real sporty dog, but like because I'm not the two of you are not serious about it we, we're not serious about it, get off the feed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly Like when it's everybody who's like training for the PSA trial. I'm like I'm not going to take my dog out. Yeah.
Speaker 2:But I think that's the cool thing about sport too is like then you sign up for a trial and you have a goal.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, it's like a thing yeah then you sign up for a trial and you have a goal. Oh yeah, it's like a thing towards you know. Yeah, but it's been cool like learning from all the super heavy obedience trainers because like it is very technical, right. But then on the other side I'm like I think I'm very skilled in just being able to read like social cues amongst dogs, which I think a lot of obedience trainers kind of miss out on, is like the group work aspect of things. You know, it's very much like black and white for them of like the dogs don't do this and they're allowed to do this, and if they do this they're going to get corrected, if they do this they're going to get rewarded, whereas, like I kind of feel like there's more of a nuance to, you know, like social communication amongst dogs.
Speaker 1:Like I will let dogs correct other dogs yeah, I mean, I also think, you know, but like they don't see that, it's like oh my gosh, this dog corrected that dog. That dog is like a problem and needs to be corrected, because they corrected the dog and it's like well, to be fair, this dog was I in that dog and putting a lot of social pressure on it, but like you don't get that with obedience training, you don't get that with sport training and I feel like that's really like my favorite part of dog training, for sure.
Speaker 2:But but there you go, like I think you kind of nailed it right there like that's what you enjoy, like you know you have a bunch of dogs. For that reason, like you like them all to interact and stuff versus I think, like you know, quote unquote like serious, like whatever, it's just sport.
Speaker 2:Sport trainers like, for the most part they have like intact male, like working line malinois or shepherds that are like already to begin with like less social, like less prone to like hang out amongst other dogs, so like the trainer is focused on the obedience aspect, builds a crazy amount of like drive and like possession for like the ball and then they don't really emphasize like the time together amongst like other dogs, so like naturally they're not also as good as like reading body cues like amongst dogs, because like they're I don't want to say their dogs don't socialize like obviously shane has, like you know, his two males.
Speaker 2:They interact, but I think like less so than like your pack of goldens. You know you don't you don't see many dog trainers online like period um you know having like um you know having like a lot of yard time with, like you know, 20 different dogs, groups of dogs, like you just don't I do miss that, I will say yeah like we couldn't get that if we had, like, a facility, you know now you need a fenced in area, for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I like the group stuff with the dogs.
Speaker 1:I've also like learned so much from it, you know you can like watch, like but that's why I know, like, when I'm watching these videos of like trainers that are like marking and rewarding like a dog, that's putting a lot of like pressure on a dog from across the field, it's like yo, if that was going on in our backyard. If a dog was doing that in our backyard, like what are you doing? No, like, I'm putting a leash on you. You're walking with me. You are not allowed to sit and stop and stare at other dogs. It's just so unnatural to me and I think the reason why I feel so strongly about that is because, like, that's something that I would never allow in a group of dogs, because I know where that state of mind is coming from. You know what I'm saying yeah, like I.
Speaker 1:I saw a video oh man, I'm gonna get, I'm talking a lot of shit, I'm gonna get, people are gonna come for me. But I saw a video, um today, of and I don't know if it was a dog trainer or a person, just like an average, average, uh owner owner.
Speaker 1:I, I don't know, I didn't watch the video with sound. I was just watching. I was just watching it and I was like, oh my gosh, I can't watch this. And it was basically just, this person was a super reactive australian shepherd and she was talking about, like, her reactivity journey and she was doing the thing that I told you I don't like, which is allowing the dog to sit and stare and rewarding that dog and how that's the only way that we're going to change their feelings about the trigger and yada, yada, yada.
Speaker 1:But in my mind, in my, you know, years of dog trainer experience, if let's say that situation was replicated in my backyard right when we have dogs out off leash and I have a reactive Aussie that I'm working through and the owner is there with me, would I ever have that owner stand there and reward that dog for staring at other dogs? No, I would not. I would say, all right, we're going into our walking drills, you need to get moving. We cannot allow this dog to fixate. Like probably wouldn't reward.
Speaker 1:If I did reward, I would have the owner like reward for the dog looking up at her in heel, you know, like that. And so when I see that, especially coming from other trainers, I'm like, oh man, you're just missing like such a big piece of it, and I think it's because not a lot of dog trainers do a lot of group start stuff. They don't see that, they don't see like the group dynamics of everything. Or even today I was watching a video about two wolves and it was explaining the dynamic of one wolf putting their like resting their head on the back of another dog yeah, it's dominance this is something that, like we, I've taught you.
Speaker 1:You know from watching all of the dogs. It's like, hey, we don't allow the dogs to put a paw on top of another dog, to put a head on top of another dog.
Speaker 1:That is like like hump yeah, yeah it's it's asserting dominance, and the video just like broke this down in wolves and it was like, yeah, this is like what they do when, uh, you know, dog that's like higher up in the hierarchy is trying to like assert themselves on another dog, and it's like, yes, that's like something that I don't allow. And in this like wolf video, it's like, oh, yeah, of course, but then I don't know. I feel like other forms of like social pressure are allowed and rewarded in dog trainer world yeah, that shouldn't be.
Speaker 2:yeah, you know, yeah, I mean even like just breaking down, like my two males here, you know, like you clearly like showed me that walter um is the problem, like amongst other dogs and stuff. He doesn't take corrections or whatever. I got Hawk after Walter so I kind of thought he was the instigator or whatever, and it turns out he has a lot better social skills with other dogs than Walter.
Speaker 1:Hawk is a good boy. Everybody loves Hawk. All the girls love Hawk. That's true. And then even when we're standing there with like, who did I have on leash with walter?
Speaker 2:oh, lucy he was getting.
Speaker 1:They're a little uncomfy as soon as he's out, yeah and like lucy started growling at walter and it's like was walter really doing anything? No, but just the vibes he brings Lucy's like don't, don't even you know. But people miss that, you know. And then they would like punish a dog like Lucy who's like nah, he's about to be an asshole, like I'm communicating to him that I don't want him to like take that next step, you know I'm saying, but like that happened to us, you know, the other day, when trainers had dogs out and a female dog corrected a male dog and they're like oh my gosh, she never does this. Like I can't, I don't know why.
Speaker 1:And I was like well, the male dog was like being very pushy and forward, not like directly, he wasn't being reactive or barking at her, but like he was eyeing her and he was walking a little too close to her, like he knew very much what he was doing. He was getting away with it because they don't correct intention. You know I correct intention, even if that's just redirecting a dog and moving them away. But I don't allow dogs to have those sorts of intentions.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because then it also builds to more you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know what comes next. Stop it while you're ahead. I know what comes next. Yeah, yeah, all right, I've made you stay up long enough. Do you want to go to bed?
Speaker 2:Hey, I mean for sure Clock out. No, I think this was a good conversation.
Speaker 1:Moral of the story.
Speaker 2:Insight on our daily lives.
Speaker 1:Moral of the story it's okay to have dog mom guilt and practice your marker words.
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, that's what it comes down to. Sometimes you can have some down days and some chill time. Also, clear communication is very important.
Speaker 1:There you go, dog training.
Speaker 2:That's a wrap.
Speaker 1:My updates for you are today, friday the 3rd, is the last day that you can sign up for my virtual shadow program, which starts on Monday. So if you're one of the beautiful people that I spoke with already, this is your last chance To join this round of our virtual shadow program. If you don't know what the virtual shadow program is, it's my online Dog trainer Program, where, in three weeks, we cover the basics of dog training. Part of that is marker words and how to properly use our marker words, and then the second half we cover all of the stuff that you need to run your own dog training business. That's what we've got going on. That starts on Monday. I'm super excited. I'm going to have like purpose in my life again.
Speaker 2:There you go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's always awesome. Is that? It? Is that all we got? Thanks for having me on. Thank you all so much for being listeners and listening to us blab on about dog training. As always, we'll see you next time.